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steven_28652

Posts: 4
Registered: 07/30/12
Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 26, 2017 12:20 AM
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Sorry, no writing advice here. Forget I said anything.

Edited by: steven_28652 on Dec 29, 2017 5:27 PM
Cynthia E. Gould

Posts: 103
Registered: 03/14/17
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 26, 2017 10:02 AM   in response to: steven_28652 in response to: steven_28652
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You're advertising your book HERE, to fellow writers?
Inappropriate. That's not the purpose of these forums.
Duane Dingle

Posts: 134
Registered: 06/04/14
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 28, 2017 6:25 PM   in response to: steven_28652 in response to: steven_28652
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Yes! You go girl! Sell those cakes to the baker! Good for you!

You're a great writer you are, just great! But your marketing needs help. Just a bit, but you can make it happen!

This is why I would poke my head in here over the last few years. Sometimes the posts can be so bizarre, they can bring a tear to my eye.

Sorry. Where was I? Oh, ya...you go girl! Sell those books!
C. Gold

Posts: 1,101
Registered: 02/17/15
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 12:51 AM   in response to: steven_28652 in response to: steven_28652
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There’s only one way to know if you’re good enough: Submit your work to magazines and book publishers. You’ll never know if you take the easy road. Harsh? Perhaps. I’ve been traditionally published and >I’ve Self Published. I wanted to earn my place at the table before I embarked on the Self-Publishing thing.

Self pub is not the easy road. Sure, it is if you want to just let your book linger in obscurity. But self pubbers do everything themselves, from choosing the cover design, the font used inside the book, to marketing it. It can feel very fulfilling, especially when the money you make comes from your own blood, sweat, and tears.

Here's my own writing advice:

Don't let trad pub authors who incorrectly think trad pub is the only way to legitimacy steal your dreams and make you feel inferior because you go the self pub route. You know if your good enough by the number of people you touch with your words. Sales = validation, not getting a trad pub deal. Grats to those who go that route, but it's not for everyone, nor should it feel required.
Salamander Mall...

Posts: 894
Registered: 10/16/17
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 7:06 AM   in response to: C. Gold in response to: C. Gold
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C. Gold wrote:
There’s only one way to know if you’re good enough: Submit your work to magazines and book publishers. You’ll never know if you take the easy road. Harsh? Perhaps. I’ve been traditionally published and >I’ve Self Published. I wanted to earn my place at the table before I embarked on the Self-Publishing thing.

Self pub is not the easy road. Sure, it is if you want to just let your book linger in obscurity. But self pubbers do everything themselves, from choosing the cover design, the font used inside the book, to marketing it. It can feel very fulfilling, especially when the money you make comes from your own blood, sweat, and tears.

Here's my own writing advice:

Don't let trad pub authors who incorrectly think trad pub is the only way to legitimacy steal your dreams and make you feel inferior because you go the self pub route. You know if your good enough by the number of people you touch with your words. Sales = validation, not getting a trad pub deal. Grats to those who go that route, but it's not for everyone, nor should it feel required.


The OP is living in the past and his advice is hopelessly outdated. Were it still the Sixties, yes, by all means, submit your short stories to any of the seventy major fiction markets, your novels to any of the hundred or so paperback and hardcover publishers then reading unagented submissions. Fast forward to the second decade of the 21st Century and you have five genre magazines barely hanging on and a handful of publishing conglomerates who will not look at your manuscript except through the auspices of an agent. And should your book be published, you'll get a mere 7-8% royalties and the goodwill of the publisher, until sales slip.

And you are quite right, CG. Self-publishing is not an easy path, not if you do it right. We've all seen the disastrous results when people do think it's an easy path and throw garbage against the wall, hoping it will stick. It never does. Their books never sell and they can't figure out why. They never will.
Brad the wronger

Posts: 344
Registered: 07/13/17
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 8:30 AM   in response to: steven_28652 in response to: steven_28652
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The cover would work well for a pirate story. "Captain Blood's Last Testament'.
Jonathan B

Posts: 4,606
Registered: 10/23/12
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 8:34 AM   in response to: steven_28652 in response to: steven_28652
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steven_28652 wrote:
There’s only one way to know if you’re good enough: Submit your work to magazines and book publishers. You’ll never know if you take the easy road. Harsh? Perhaps. I’ve been traditionally published and I’ve Self Published. I wanted to earn my place at the table before I embarked on the Self-Publishing thing.

OK, you can get off your high horse now.

The only way to know if you are "good enough," and I'm being very liberal with the term, is to write and see if the reading public likes what you wrote. That reading public might be only your mother and great-aunt, or it might be millions of readers who pick up the book. Being self-pubbed or trad-pubbed is not the bellweather.

Granted, most trad-published works have been through at least one level of quality control, but that does not mean the aquisition editor is the sole arbiter of what is "good enough."

If I had sent my first novel to the big publishing houses, there is no doubt in my mind that I would have been relegated to slush pile purgatory. Instead, on a lark, I self-published, and with a vanity press, no less, as all I wanted were some copies to give to family and friends. Several years later, I put out the same book as an eBook. Since then, I've sold more books than I ever thought possible, made more money that the bulk of the trad-published writers, and thoroughly enjoyed the process. I've turned down agents, I've turned down contracts from trad publishers, and finally accepted one where I thought the process would help me improve my craft.

Am I "good enough?" Hubris aside, I'd like to think I am. And I've read hundreds of my fellow indie writers' books that as a reader, were certainly "good enough." A good portion of them were more than good enough: they were mind-blastingly fanatastic.

Ed Augusts

Posts: 473
Registered: 01/27/13
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 12:02 PM   in response to: steven_28652 in response to: steven_28652
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Difficult finding "Bleed For Me" with so much competition from "Bleed With Me", "Bleed Me Blue", "Bleed Me Silicone", "Bleed Me Gently," and more. Book (novella) is available from 3rd party sellers only. 3 out of 5 stars, the only review. "Story flowed well.. " Was "flowed" sarcasm? I would never read a book with a cover showing a woman who's evidently cut herself open, with her blood draining into a sewer. No wonder this book is out of print and only available from 3rd parties. OP should continue writing, and with more heart, and with, hopefully, some aesthetics and niceties, to attain the real success which has eluded him, and NOT look back with such pride to a book swimming in a woman's blood.

Edited by: Ed Augusts on Dec 29, 2017 12:03 PM
Notjohn

Posts: 23,805
Registered: 02/27/13
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 1:59 PM   in response to: C. Gold in response to: C. Gold
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Don't let trad pub authors who incorrectly think trad pub is the only way to legitimacy steal your dreams and make you feel inferior because you go the self pub route.

Yes, never let the facts intrude upon delusion!

(Don't trust KDP to publish a print edition. Don't trust CreateSpace to publish an ebook. Each does one thing well and the other thing poorly.)

Good luck! -- NJ

Notjohn's Guide to E-Book & Print Formatting

The blog:
http://notjohnkdp.blogspot.com
Amis

Posts: 267
Registered: 02/25/17
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 2:32 PM   in response to: steven_28652 in response to: steven_28652
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steven_28652 wrote:
There’s only one way to know if you’re good enough: Submit your work to magazines and book publishers. You’ll never know if you take the easy road. Harsh? Perhaps. I’ve been traditionally published and I’ve Self Published. I wanted to earn my place at the table before I embarked on the Self-Publishing thing.

I take it from this that you consider self-publishing the “easy road”. I disagree. From what I’ve picked up here and elsewhere those who make a living at self-publishing are putting in a lot of hard work (doing everything a traditional publisher would do) to put out quality products and market them well.

IMO it’s really just a matter of where you want to put the work in. You can spend your energy submitting to publishers and risk never finding one or you can spend it on the process of publishing your work yourself and risk not getting sales.

Personally I chose self-publishing because I would rather let the market judge my work than a gatekeeper. I may not have earned my “place at the table” (whatever that means) but almost 800 people bought or borrowed* my book. To some that’s a drop in the bucket but my goal was to write the book I wanted to read, get it out in the world and cover my costs for doing so. I had fun doing it and I made some money after covering my costs so I consider it a success. This may sound snarky but if my goal were to write full-time I’d be taking my advice from those who have achieved that goal themselves.

*counting the equivalent number of pages read as one borrow.
Duane Dingle

Posts: 134
Registered: 06/04/14
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 2:59 PM   in response to: steven_28652 in response to: steven_28652
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Ok, so I couldn't help myself (I have little self-control, so little I keep it in a safe so I don't lose it) and looked at your titles on Amazon. You have a short story, a novella and a short book on something to do with writing, but by its two sentence blurb and its sample's foreword and introduction I expect it's about your vast experience in the publishing business. Your works have close to no reviews and the works you've published for other authors have even less, so I'm left wondering how successful are you in the indie publishing world and how successful were you in the traditional publishing world, even with your claim to be a "Critically acclaimed short story writer" in one blurb. You obviously haven't marketed at all or haven't marketed your books well, expecting them to sell on their own, and it makes me suspect that this post is your attempt at marketing your book on writing/publishing to writers. It would be sad if it wasn't so bizarre that there are so many authors who fail in the indie publishing business and then decide to target writers with their books covering their vast knowledge on how to achieve success, or offer services to them, or both. And I don't think claiming to be recognized as a wonderful author will fool many readers and, in case your intent was to market your how-to book here, I'm sure it'll fool no one on here too.

Edited: Oh, and because you may know one or more award winning writers does not in any way make you one by association.

Edited by: Duane Dingle on Dec 29, 2017 3:08 PM
Jonathan B

Posts: 4,606
Registered: 10/23/12
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 3:20 PM   in response to: Duane Dingle in response to: Duane Dingle
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Duane Dingle wrote:

Edited: Oh, and because you may know one or more award winning writers does not in any way make you one by association.


This!
B.L. Alley

Posts: 1,241
Registered: 06/14/14
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 4:58 PM   in response to: steven_28652 in response to: steven_28652
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I hope your arm is okay after patting yourself on the back. This reminds me of all the guys I've met who fixed a leaky faucet or replaced a broken light switch once and decided they were home improvement experts or skilled tradesmen and therefore qualified to give out advice or charge others for their services.
chris

Posts: 115
Registered: 09/26/14
Re: Some Writing Advice
Posted: Dec 30, 2017 11:10 AM   in response to: steven_28652 in response to: steven_28652
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I see the OP has deleted his comment, so this comment isn't a response to his at all -- it's just a response to the trad pub vs. self pub thing.

Trad publishing thing isn't for everybody. It instantly shuts the gate for many.

I'm self published, after trying the trad pub route. I discovered that mailing and emailing query letters to literary agents was a waste of my time -- time that would be much better spent writing and self-publishing.

I am not a big seller by any stretch. But I have sold a few copies of several short ebooks, and some reviews indicate that readers were happy with what they read.

Job accomplished. If I had tried to sell those ebooks the trad way -- via the usual hoops one has to jump through just to get your feet in the door -- no one would have read those books by now, if ever.
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